Advanced Tactics: Punishment

Welcome to the first edition of Advanced Tactics, brought to you by the Darien Brotherhood. This is the first installment of however many I feel like making. The next one could be tomorrow or next year. Whatever, let's proceed.

First off, let me add that this particular segment is exclusive to third party maps. If you knew me well then you would know why I have to explain this.

In today's edition we will be talking about Punishment - aka; Window Timing.

What is Punishment?

Punishment is the science of catching your opponent with their pants down - this window of opportunity will happen every game between the 2 and 4 minute mark. Usually you can determine who used this rule at the end of the game by looking at their score. The higher the score, the more they made proper use of their mana in countering what their opponent did. Sometimes there are exceptions to the rule.

Let me reiterate that last statement.

The opportunity to Punish your opponent WILL happen every game betwwen the 2 and 4 minute mark. It will also arise several more times throughout the course of the match, however every time decreases its significance. For example, you could be on a small map and your opponent began making a Citadel at the 1:30 mark. This means that he is not commiting his mana to making troops or defenses early in the game. This leaves you with 2 possible options - leave him alone or administer Punishment.

The first thing you need to consider in this scenario is enivronment. Could you get there in time on that size of a map? What race is he and what are his capabilities? What are your capabilities? Let's assume the latter checks out to atleast 50/50. Moving on...

You think it's possible, in this scenario, to use your mana better then he does pound for pound - in turn Punishing your opponent for what you to perceive as a bad choice. So now, you abondon your half built gate, bastion, citadel, or whatever, immediately put all your resources towards another barracks and continue to rush your opponent. You rush your monarch up there to force his monarch to use his T2 spells and move in with mass infantry. Now that his mana is all gone he can't wave your men.

One of the most important things to remember about a scenario like that is if it won't kill him immediately, don't worry - most of the time it isn't supposed to. Rushing is not about massively overwhelming your opponent to win, it's about gaining leverage in decision making. Forcing him to do things. Reacting to you instead of you reacting to him, and having a counter reaction in production ahead of time. Alot of players win through rushing or getting a fast tech by complete folly because they are oblivious to these mechanics. In the art of Punishment, by reacting first, you create the environment which you can take control of the game.

As stated before, this rule has severely diminishing returns. You can rush in to force him to make towers, all the while producing blade demons to counter them. This works 3-4 minutes into the game, not at 20. After a certain point when defenses have been established it becomes a different ballgame. If you get this this point in the game then you have missed your window.

Next time you play on a third party map and think that;

- Aramon is all cannon/archer,

- Veruna is all zerker/mon rush,

- Taros is all fire demon/mage,

- etc, etc...

...just remember, it's your fault for letting that happen in the first place. It's also your fault for not scouting and dealing with it properly.

Double-DB signing off.


Shoryuken!!!

Good stuff, Hatebreeder! It is true that most people think that only 30% of TA:Kingdoms units are useful, but this is mainly because "THEY use them all the time" and not "EVERYONE uses them all the time", if you know what I mean. I have recently viewed TAUniverse's threads about TAK and 9/10 of people there think that TAK is broken to shit! However, the interesting part is the reason behind the oppinion of the 9 dislikers of TAK:

- 1st Opinion:
TAK is ubalanced, because the defences are too strong!

- 2nd Opinion:
TAK is unbalanced, because defences are weak and everyone can rush you early in a game!

- 3rd Opinion:
TAK is unbalanced, because Aramon kicks \"***\" everywhere! Titans, Mage Archers, Cannons, Elsin are unbeatable!

- 4th Opinion:
TAK is unbalanced, because Veruna kicks \"***\" everywhere! They have the best expand time, very cheap units and the best navy!

- 5th Opinion:
TAK is unbalanced, because Taros kicks \"***\" everywhere! Weather Witches in Ghost Ships or Fire Mages rape everything, let alone Fire Deamons or Blade Deamons!

- 6th Opinion:
TAK is unbalanced, because Zhon kicks \"***\" everywhere! Thirsa is extremely mobile in comparison with the rests monarchs, she can fly fast and expand faster than the rest, they have Stone Giants, Basilisks, Drakes etc. and these awesome Jungle Orcs thrown into your base by Rocs!

- 7th Opinion:
TAK is unbalanced, because Creon kick sass everywhere! Aerial Juggernaut, Neo Dragons, Beast Riders, Iron Clads rape the whole battlefield!

- 8th Opinion:
TAK is shit, because it needs a lot of micromanagement, there is only one resource and it is unlimited (mana), it has a slow gaming pace, graphics sucks, it is buggy even after the patches etc.

- 9th Opinion (the most common opinion, lol):
TAK is shit, because I am a hardcore TA player and TAK is different than TA, I hate it because Chris Taylor wasn't behind its production, I hate it because Cavedog collasped right after creating it and if it wasn't that shitty TA:Kingdoms game around Cavedog would had created TA2 instead!!!

- 10th Opinion (my opinion, lol!):
TAK is awesome and pretty well-balanced, because it all depends on the map, race and strategies you have. TAK can be pretty defensive and slow paced if you want to build up a steady defense or extremely agressive and fast paced if you want to rush your opponent from the very beginning. The one resource (mana) need to be used cautiously around, because both you and your opponent have unlimited resources, both need to expand and capture several Sacred Stones around the map, and if you keep spending your mana recklessly you will be raped badly (personally, I have lost several matches due to bad mana management). TAK graphics and animations were great for a fantasy RTS of its time and it looks good even today in a high resolution setting. All of those who say TAK is broken to shit they should reconsider and replay the game (and this time not to stop playing after a match or two, but to give it a serious play!).

Thanks Hatebreeder for your tactics above! I may try to use them online, muhahahahaha!

Good stuff Arthan and DB

Let me just quote what's definitive for any player in any map:

Hatebreeder-DB wrote:

The first thing you need to consider in this scenario is enivronment. Could you get there in time on that size of a map? What race is he and what are his capabilities? What are your capabilities?

...just remember, it's your fault for letting that happen in the first place. It's also your fault for not scouting and dealing with it properly.

And there's a thing that may pass unseen, something that I just realized after many years. I know that what Hatebreeder said about score was used in context to explain his ideas. But let me just add that the score of a player increases as he kills units from other players (even from allys). If I kill a Spyhawk, my score is gonna increase by 30, because that's the experience of this unit. Actually I just realized it, it's a good way to check when the enemy is feeding his dragon Especially in treb-titan-endless games, when nothing is going on but the score of the guy with a Gold Dragon keeps increasing by 30, 60, 90 lol. Keep your F4 on just in case Score is useful in many contexts, especially when you know more or less the experience of at least some units or type of units. This gives you an idea of what units - or how many - were killed. Like "did that last hit kill his monarch?" Just check if your experience increased by 300 (if I'm not mistaken).

By the way sorry if I always have something to say in this forum. Somethings hardly change I will probably not play multiplayer ever again (except with my brother or friends) but I'm still interested in anything about TAK. This game just deserves much more than what it has right now.

And great banner Double

I didnt know feeding Dragon was against the "rules" =/

It's not against the rules. It's just unethical.

It's like kicking a guy in the balls in soccer (football) on accident but you really didn't do it on accident.

I see

But I remember I once read somewhere that War IS unethical

Personally, I think it depends on your fraction. If you play Taros, for example, why on earth Lokken should spare a few Gargoyles that would be a yummy desert for his Black Dragon? Is the vilest necromancer going to feel mercy for those Gargoyles? I think not.
However, I think Lokken is NOT the only one who would do this. Thirsa would gladly accept to feed her Ancient Dragon with bats (food chain is rule number one of mother nature!) and the good children (Elsin, Kirenna) send their Swordsmen/Warriors as cannon fodder to die painfully in early rushes, why should they care about feeding their Golden/Sea dragons with tasty Spyhawks/Parrots?
It seems that, each fraction has an excuse to power up their holy winged horrors. After all, a pet needs food every day, doesn't it?

Enough hijacking my thread.

Keep it on subject please. Yeah yeah I'm guilty too.

Hatebreeder-DB wrote:

Enough hijacking my thread.

Keep it on subject please. Yeah yeah I'm guilty too.

Also guilty for speedjacking... but that is another story.

I've got proof on you.

Do you have proof on me?

Shall I repost it?

I don't care what you think you got on me... the fact of the matter is you aren't all what you make yourself out to be. You are an egotistical child... using words like.. PUNISHMENT (bolded in red of course)... and having an avatar of confederate flag and what appears to be a Jesus smoking a cigarette? If that doesn't scream "LOOK AT ME! I NEED ATTENTION"... I don't know what does. Also IMP_ARTHAN wasn't trying to "hijack" your thread. You are just mad that someone got some attention other then you. He was making a pleasant comment and you had to turn it around like someone is outdoing you. Grow up kid. I am pretty sure people like you ruin this dieing community with your attitude.

PS: This is the last comment I will make on this thread. Feel free to pick it all apart and write your rebuttal as immature as I am sure it will be.

Lmfao

But who's not egotistical in this world... if you say you're not you're just an hypocrite. And let's agree that bitches and flamers (maybe it looks like I'm defending myself lol) don't destroy this game, they are actually a sign that this game is alive

By the way that's Pepper Keenan smoking a joint on the rebel flag. Check out the band Down.

PUNISHMENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Badass strat

I will think about the window next game